earlgreytea68 | The Chaosverse Book Club: Week Four

Chapter Two of Chaos Theory

This chapter is mainly about Jackie. I don't think I ever intended to spend as much time on Jackie as I've ended up doing in this 'verse, but I'm absolutely fascinated by her relationship with her daughter and the strange family her daughter chose.

You know, I forgot that there's an implication in this chapter that Rose's ability to have Time Lord children might be unusual. I have never reached the point, in my thinking about Brem, where he wants to have children, but I wonder if that's ever an issue for these future generations. Hmm.

Questions for Discussion:

I make lots of references to the Doctor and Jackie sharing terrible taste in television. What do you like to imagine they watch together?

Chapter Three of Chaos Theory

The TARDIS is nurturing. What's interesting about this is that, in "College," we learn that the around this time the Doctor must have taken some coral from the TARDIS to start growing Brem's TARDIS. I wonder if he's already done it here, and that the TARDIS is actually nurturing the baby TARDIS and it's manifesting this way. I like to think that's why.

It's always bothered me a little bit that the Doctor doesn't realize immediately that he can sense the baby. One has to imagine his head is pretty cavernous with all the Time Lords gone, and he feels a tickle in the back of his mind, and, by his own words, he doesn't pay attention to it. I find that stretches credulity a bit.

You know, I always write the TARDIS as being very fond of Rose, but I think in my head that's not because of Rose's Bad-Wolf-ness but because the TARDIS loves the Doctor and Rose makes the Doctor happy. I guess either explanation could work, though.

Rose worries that the baby will replace her, which clearly doesn't happen. But I find it interesting that the opposite almost comes to pass: The Doctor and Brem turn out to be so much alike that, rather than being able to read each other's thoughts, they are amazingly obtuse about each other.

Questions for Discussion:

2nd2ndalto, in a recent comment, said that there's always one line in a fic that sticks with her. What's your one line from this chapter?

Chapter Four of Chaos Theory

You know, I think the Doctor never fully gets the hang of living with a non-telepathic creature like Rose. In this chapter, Rose is determined to have it out, to discuss their feelings, and the Doctor is irritated. I think at least part of the Doctor's irritation stems from the fact that, as a telepathic being, he thinks she should just be able to sense how he feels, and he'll sense how she feels, and then they never have to have a messy discussion about it. I think Time Lords, on the whole, dislike messy emotional confrontation, for this reason.

Rose's doubt in this chapter about her utility as a mother to Gallifreyans rings true to me. But it's especially heartbreaking in light of the fact that we eventually get to see her children trying to make a life without their mother, and we know what a complete disaster it is without her.

Ah, the pendant. Sometimes I remember Rose's pendant, most of the time I forget about it completely. I'm the worst at continuity.

This is a sex scene I actually really like, because I think it's fun.

Questions for Discussion:

Ah, there's been much speculation. What are those thoughts the Doctor leaves out? What did you always imagine them to be?

Next Week: Chapters 5, 6, and 7 of Chaos Theory in Vortex Orbits in Relative Dimensions in Time and Space

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

I love Jackie in your 'verse' and I love how supportive she is of Rose here. I also love that she's willing to ask the Doctor all those questions. It's an interesting way of having her gradually come to accept all this.

I forgot that there's an implication in this chapter that Rose's ability to have Time Lord children might be unusual. Hmmm I read that as it's unusual because very few Time Lords have or would mate with humans and because, given the complex nature of triple helix DNA, it's difficult and complicated. So not impossible, just not done very often. So I guess what I'm saying is that I read it as any human female COULD have a Time Lord child but most wouldn't. Does that make sense?

Oh I love the idea that the Doctor is already growing a TARDIS for Brem in this chapter and that's contributing to the TARDIS's nurturing nature. Although, given the Doctor's grumpiness about the nurturing at first I wonder if maybe he decided to grow Brem a TARDIS right after this instead. Like maybe after the scene where he realizes that his fretting has panicked his baby, and as part of that he realizes how much he loves the baby and also how he wants to baby to have a TARDIS of it's own one day.

You know, I always write the TARDIS as being very fond of Rose, but I think in my head that's not because of Rose's Bad-Wolf-ness but because the TARDIS loves the Doctor and Rose makes the Doctor happy. I guess either explanation could work, though. I like option B better also. I like to think too that the TARDIS has come to love Rose for being Rose just as the Doctor has. (But not just because the Doctor does).

This is the first time I've read these chapters since reading through the first time and it's interesting to me how many little things become ironic or precious or touching with the advantage of forsight. The happy moments are sometimes bittersweet (and yet even more precious) because we know they won't last forever, and it's amusing to see how very different things turn out from how Rose and the Doctor seem to expect them to turn out. Which I suppose is a lot like real life. We always have so many expectations for our futures and they seldom turn out the way we expect although often we do end up with something better and richer than we ever dreamed possible - which ultimately is what the Doctor and Rose get. I don't think either of them would believe it at this time in their life if someone came to them and told them that one day they'd have 3 very happy, healthy, Time Lord Children and they'd be together and in love and happy for HUNDREDS of years. They just wouldn't fathom it at this point. Which I think is actually kinda beautiful.

What's your one line from this chapter

I was going to pick the bit about him cuddling the baby in his mind because I thing that's just such an adorable and beautiful image, but then I came across this and it stood out to me even more:

You are never going to make it through this if you stop talking to him.

I find that line really fascinating because if you think about it, this advice could apply to Rose's whole life with the Doctor, not just Brems birth. I think one reason their relationship works so well for so many years is that Rose started learning at this point how important it is to make him talk to her even when he doesn't want to talk or doesn't think he needs to talk. It's easy to forget that they are completely different species of beings but the reality is that the Doctor does not think or function the way that humans do and Rose has to learn to communicate with him what her needs are because he's not going to ever be able to figure that out intuitively. On the other side of this, Rose also learns to listen to the Doctor so she can understand and accept where he's coming from. It also is vital information for her so she can learn what battles to pick and which ones to drop. This communication is so important because otherwise they'd never be able to make it work long term.

This is the beginning of the alliance that the Doctor and Jackie forge for Rose's sake. It begins right here.

Your reading of what the Doctor says is exactly correct, that it's unusual for humans to have Time Lord babies because humans seldom slept with Time Lords. However, the Doctor says something about how Rose has a particular DNA sequence that makes the pregnancy possible. The Doctor says it could be a common sequence, but it could also be an uncommon one, that he's not sure, so there's at least a possibility that Rose is unique.

Hmm, yes, the Doctor could also decide to create the TARDIS for Brem after this. Maybe he thinks he can distract the TARDIS into nurturing Brem's TARDIS instead of putting bows all over the bedrooms. ;-)

I don't think I even knew at this point what would lie in store for the Doctor and Rose! It's been quite an amazing journey!

Yes, you're right, Rose and the Doctor always keep their lines of communication open. When the Doctor is inclined to be sulky and silent, Rose makes him talk. And when the Doctor has no idea what's gotten into Rose, he usually makes her talk, too. Sometimes they shout at each other, but at least they're still *talking,* and that's the only way they can even begin to figure each other out and make their complicated life together work.

The Chaosverse Book Club: Week Four

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